12 Back Questions ?

Gents I have 3 questions please . I have been looking at 12 Backs on E Bay and I have noticed some of them say 12 back A, 12 Back B or 12 Back C . Were the 12 Back A's the 1st run in 1977 then the B's in 1978 ? Or how does it work ?

If something is AFA Graded does that mean it is 100% original and can't be faked ? or are there Vintage Toys on the Market that have been AFA faked ?

I figured that MOC are the figures still in their original packaging, what does MOC stand for ?

Apologies for the beginner questions but I guess I got to ask to learn.

Moc means MINT ON CARD and means the figure is still attached behind the plastic bubble on the original card.

Yes, AFA graded stuff is mostly safe, but there had been some AFA stuff faked on the Bay. You can try to check the AFA number that comes along with the grading but a 100% safe stuff can never be bought these days.

About the twelve backs... The letters stand for different looks of the cards, say A is the original card, some later cards (B etc.) have different logos, offer stickers ("Boba Fett Offer", "Free Nien Numb Figure" etc.) or else.

Hope that helps, mate.

AFA is by no means a way to determine whether an item is genuine.

They graded hundreds upon hundreds of Toy Toni figures (check the link on this scam) which were not original sealed figures. Very recently we also saw on eBay that someone had faked an AFA sticker and box too, so there is certainly no guarantees just because item has been graded.

If you're new to collecting the Toy Toni thread is definitely something to check up so you don't get stung by purchasing one of these items.

Let's not panic too much, the Toni scandal (if undoubtably proved) indeed fooled AFA & UKG and all of us etc but that was due to all elements of a Toni MOC being original ie card, bubble and figure! When, where and by who these MOCs were sealed was where the scam lurked!

So pretty much apart from this an AFA graded piece is prob going to b totally original. The few AFA custom made pieces seem to b easy to tell from a genuine actual AFA graded piece

As for the differences between 12 back A, B & C etc

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CAwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.12back.com%2Ffeatures%2Fcardbacks%2Fcardbacks.php3&ei=gMAKVJa-JJLnaI7UgZAO&usg=AFQjCNGKWCmi2JDpRutB5roMPJeMVZy2Rw&sig2=HKlT4coKX1Lhc2-hZy9Lag

What he said above^^^.

I doubt very much there is a fake 12 back that has been AFA rated. They charge more for grading 12 backs as they spend more time checking them out.

If your unsure about buying one there are plenty of people on here who could help you out.

Fantastic advice, many thanks to all the replies.

Hi

Fake 12 backs are usually poor, but they can catch the unsuspecting buyer out, particularly if you are new to the game. I would give you the following advice if using ebay.

This gets missed quite a lot but look at the sellers feedback and see what they are selling. If they have sold 50 12 backs in the last month they are either fake or a big time dealer. Most of those are well known, so pump their username into google search as well as the forum and you should get some reference to the seller, good or bad.

Then, get some close up photos of the card. You are looking at bubbles and seals, print quality, fonts, alignments and a few other things. Again, if you are not sure get some photos and put them up on the forum. You will find people here are more than willing to help you out. Alarm. Alarm bells ring here if they won't give you decent pictures or claim they only have a camera phone and the blurry rubbish is the best they can do.

AFA have lost credibility over toy Toni, but that is an exceptional event. He never made 12 backs and he wasn't making repro. He was using mostly original parts and assembling them at a later date (we think). You will pay a lot more for an AFA moc than a non graded one.

Good luck in your search. 12 backs are not the cheapest to go after but there is something very pure about the first 12 in a collection on starwars card backs.

I have another question gents.

Are 12 Back A's more collectible than a 12 Back B then a 12 Back C ?

In other words if you had a 12 Back A AFA Graded 85 and a 12 Back B AFA Graded 85 would the 12 Back A be more valuable ?

Hope I make sense .

Thanks in advance
Shaun

Yes a 12 back A is more collectible than a 12 back b or c. The main reason being that the 12 back A's were the first ever carded figures to be released.

Well for me personally i don't care if its a 12 Back A, B or C.
But to other collectors it does matter and recent ebay sales show that some people pay a premium for a high grade 12 back A over an high Grade 12 back B or C.
I my mind it is subjective, just like if the card is punched or not, some people only want unpunched cards, others don't care. IMO a punched card doesn't distract to the overall look of the card and every 12 back front is the same, so a 12 back is a 12 back for me.

Many prices are based on popularity for certain figures or cardbacks.
As you stated a 12 Back A is more desired, whilst for ecample a 12Back D is more rarer.
This also applies to figure variations on 12 Backs, for example an 12 Back VC Jawa also goes for silly money, whilst an 12 Back Large Han Head is much rarer and isn't quit as expensive.

So prices are not also determined on rarity, but more on the desirability for certain card/characters.

Got to agree with BobaSkinner here. Dont ever think of AFA and UKG pieces as being a sign of an authentic item anymore, moreso AFA. They shot themselves in the foot bigtime with the TT scandal and were even caught grading a previously opened resealed Ackbar years back.

I still think that there are other fakes out there that have been graded, and they are not TT pieces....but thats my opinion.