The Mega Rare Palitoys...

There has been a good deal of chat over the past few months about some mega tough Palitoy cards. Namely, 41bk Dengar and a few of the first 12 characters on 30bk cards.

Some contributors claim to own or have owned these, although are unable or unwilling to post pictures. That's their call and I don't want to discuss the rights or wrongs of this.

But why are these figures and cardbacks so rare? Why do virtually no used cardbacks turn up, let alone carded figures?

Han Solo on a 30bk shows up as a used cardback every now and again, but nowhere near as often as Luke X-wing on a 30bk does. Luke X-wing was released later in the line than Han, and there are many MOC examples of LXW 20bks, so you could assume they made plenty and even had some overstock. You could say the same for Leia and Ben as Han.

Other 30bk cardbacks just never show up - DSC, Chewie, Han, Leia and Ben are known and cardbacks have been sold publicly. The other 7 of the 12bk characters and 7 of the 20bks (excluding LXW) just NEVER show up even as damaged cardbacks in childhood collections.

So...

Were they never generally released - perhaps only released to a handful of retailers? Major Department stores maybe? Just a certain geographic area? Were they factory samples - prototypes almost? They simply can't (IMO) have been on full open general release.

My Han cardback has a toyshop sticker on it, so definitely wasn't a sample and was sold in a shop.

Is the alternative that other figures (the ones we do see as cardbacks or mocs) were released in such massive numbers that anything released as a limited run (the 30bks above, or 41bk Dengar) just doesn't stand a chance of surviving, statistically?

Any thoughts?

Replying to my own post here, but maybe - without giving anything away they don't want to - the owners of these pieces could perhaps shed some light on them. Do they have price stickers/edge wear? Did they come from a factory source or a kids collection? In their opinion were they a sample or sorts, or just released in very small numbers?

Always good for a discussion, this topic.

Without knowing the exact production dates of each card back I don't think we're likely to find out the true answer to these anomolies. Was Dengar a late release on 41back and so only a very few made it out to store before being releases on 45a (where he's also a **** to find, incidentally!). Was Luke X-Wing also late in the run on 20s but produced in such huge quantities (he was, after all the hero) but failed to sell as well as expected due to him also making up 10% of the figure line up (at 20 back stage) given he'd already had a release on Farm Boy guise?

I can't remember where I heard this or if it is true but...

Figures may have been returned when a new line came out and repackaged in the new packaging.

The original 12 on 30 back are near to impossible, easier (though still mega tough) on 41 and easier, but still very hard on 45a. Some of them continue to be very easy on Jedi cards.

12/20 may not have been initially repackaged as they may not have been entirely sure on the continuation of the films/toy run until ESB which in my opinion was probably the height of SW toys. They probably remained on the shelves and so consequently they appear in pretty good numbers.

This may also be the reason why 30 back re-releases were in smaller numbers, but by 41/45 back releases the numbers of 12/20 backs had diminished enough (or they had been sent back for repackaging) that they were re-released on later ESB cards/repackaged on them.


Just a thought, based on a vague recollection of a conversation I had with someone, at some point at some time in the past :?

sith-smith said:

I can't remember where I heard this or if it is true but... Figures may have been returned when a new line came out and repackaged in the new packaging.

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Yes the very earliest Sansweet book said this, which is why you get small head Han and vinyl cape Jawas on ESB cards (although both very rare now)

edd_jedi said:

Yes the very earliest Sansweet book said this, which is why you get small head Han and vinyl cape Jawas on ESB cards (although both very rare now)

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are you talking about the Aussie VC Jawa? That can not be a 'repack' ?

Why do you think that? I can't see any other explanation for a 1978 figure being on a 1980 cardback

edd_jedi said:

Why do you think that? I can't see any other explanation for a 1978 figure being on a 1980 cardback

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I'm not sure a 12bk toltoys VC Jawa has surfaced, has it?

The things that consume our minds that the rest of the world has no idea about :lol:

I'm no Toltoys expert to be honest! I can't see why they would start pumping out vinyl capes 2 years after the rest of the world had been using cloth ones though. It's probably just a case of none confirmed on a SW card yet like the Palitoy one was for years.

sith-smith said:

I can't remember where I heard this or if it is true but...

Figures may have been returned when a new line came out and repackaged in the new packaging.

The original 12 on 30 back are near to impossible, easier (though still mega tough) on 41 and easier, but still very hard on 45a. Some of them continue to be very easy on Jedi cards.

12/20 may not have been initially repackaged as they may not have been entirely sure on the continuation of the films/toy run until ESB which in my opinion was probably the height of SW toys. They probably remained on the shelves and so consequently they appear in pretty good numbers.

This may also be the reason why 30 back re-releases were in smaller numbers, but by 41/45 back releases the numbers of 12/20 backs had diminished enough (or they had been sent back for repackaging) that they were re-released on later ESB cards/repackaged on them.


Just a thought, based on a vague recollection of a conversation I had with someone, at some point at some time in the past :?

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Are there any shop photos from back in the day that show 30b for the first 12/20 characters? That would kinda back up this theory.



Jason

mr_palitoy said:

Are there any shop photos from back in the day that show 30b for the first 12/20 characters? That would kinda back up this theory.

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How so? I have 30bk cardbacks for the first 12 with price stickers, so they were definitely retailed.

maxf said:

mr_palitoy said:

Are there any shop photos from back in the day that show 30b for the first 12/20 characters? That would kinda back up this theory.

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How so? I have 30bk cardbacks for the first 12 with price stickers, so they were definitely retailed.

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Would love to see those. We've only seen pictures of 5 so far...



Jason

mr_palitoy said:

maxf said:

mr_palitoy said:

Are there any shop photos from back in the day that show 30b for the first 12/20 characters? That would kinda back up this theory.

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How so? I have 30bk cardbacks for the first 12 with price stickers, so they were definitely retailed.

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Would love to see those. We've only seen pictures of 5 so far...



Jason

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I dont have any you havent seen! Poor phrasing on my part!

I think what Gary says follows. So when all the SW characters were exhausted on 12&20 back Palitoy released them again in the 30b back era and prob at the v end of that era which would account for their scarcity.
Regarding some of the figures being non existent perhaps the likes of the Aliens and droids were not promoted much during the early part of the Empire era and made a come back later on ie 45a era and beyond.
Then again look at Vader. Have never seen a 30 back card back let alone the MOC and he featured big time in Empire-the star of the show IMO :!: So it does seem pretty random. Again why is R2 found relatively easy on a 41 and 3PO virtually impossible :?: Same with those on the 45a :!:

Palitoy certainly does leave us scratching our heads :roll:

Great post Max, some good points asked...

Ok, you know I like keeping my cards close, but heres a little snippet of info.....

The Palitoy 30 backs were not samples, they were definately put into production to be circulated, Im not sure what month they were released and Im not sure how long they were sold for, I never knew how rare these were until recently and Im not sure why they are so rare.
All I can really tell you is from concrete evidence that I observed.

A while ago I opened a sealed case of 48 sw figures, a plain brown cardboard box with a white label on the side stating sw 48 assorted, I expected the case to be full of Palitoy 12bks and 20bks, basically a mixed assortment.

The case consisted of 26 x 12bks, 9 x 20bks and the rest were 30 bks, this was new to me as I had never seen ESB figures packed with 12 and 20 backs before, at first I never took much notice until later when I was advised of the value of a few of these.

Hope that helps mate.

Great post Max. Not sure we'll ever get to the bottom of this mystery.

Would love for more to emerge this year.

Interesting post mate, so how many of the 13 30 backs were SW characters-and which ones if u don't mind sharing :?:

Andyclarke said:

Great post Max. Not sure we'll ever get to the bottom of this mystery.

Would love for more to emerge this year.

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Me too Andy, me too, I will get digging around on my next trip...

palitoyjunky said:

Interesting post mate, so how many of the 13 30 backs were SW characters-and which ones if u don't mind sharing :?:

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I know there were 3 luke bespins and 2 or 3 others and the rest were the first 12, if Im totally honest I really cant remember exactly cos the 12,20,30,41, 45 back thingy sends me nuts actually.......and what with sorting stuff for CE last July and sorting out customers wants, in the end I gave up......as I was lost with it.

Sorry I cant help more due to the fact my old phone packed in and I lost the list which I had in my phone notes....gone nightmare...