v weapons....

is this a v5 taiwan imperial blaster? i just read

a blaster is a blaster to me

blue blue/black black....

i dont get it.

original stormie orginal blaster. jobs done imo

i couldnt give a **** about what colour or barrel shape

i mean i like variant figures but pairing figures up with the 'supposed correct family' guns abit too far for me

i dunno collectors hey....were all different :lol:

but hey we love vintage so all is good

I'm finding it all a bit too extreme myself.
Working in the field that I do, I see multiple iterations of a design in its life time, rarely with a considered change in mind and also a mix of parts to make up that final item. A variant figure is one thing, but categorising a weapon or accessory to be only found with one mould of variant figure seems a stretch to me. We have (compared to manufactured) a very limited number of each MOC to be able to make such claims/assumptions.
Broader suggestions are fine, but even they can be unpicked with Tri-logo MOCs at times...

poncho said:

is this a v5 taiwan imperial blaster? i just read

a blaster is a blaster to me

blue blue/black black....

i dont get it.

original stormie orginal blaster. jobs done imo

i couldnt give a **** about what colour or barrel shape

i mean i like variant figures but pairing figures up with the 'supposed correct family' guns abit too far for me

i dunno collectors hey....were all different :lol:

but hey we love vintage so all is good

Click to expand...

Well we allready do it a little bit. If you buy a lili ledy, pbp, meccano, toltoys, top toys or glasslite figure then most of us want them with a correct weapon. Most of us I think will have a lili ledy klaatu with a lili ledy weapon and not a kenner weapon :lol:

Pomse2001 said:

Well we allready do it a little bit. If you buy a lili ledy, pbp, meccano, toltoys, top toys or glasslite figure then most of us want them with a correct weapon. Most of us I think will have a lili ledy klaatu with a lili ledy weapon and not a kenner weapon :lol:

Click to expand...

I agree with you there Lars, but I just dont have the patience or skills to take it to the next level. Even with the guides I really struggle categorising my blasters

Well the first thing you have to remember is that all of this stuff is completely made up by collectors in recent years. There was no such thing as a v blaster 5 years ago, or a family mould 2 years ago. I'm not saying they serve no purpose, but they are fan-made, that's a fact. Kenner themselves did not use any of these naming conventions.

spoons said:

Pomse2001 said:

Well we allready do it a little bit. If you buy a lili ledy, pbp, meccano, toltoys, top toys or glasslite figure then most of us want them with a correct weapon. Most of us I think will have a lili ledy klaatu with a lili ledy weapon and not a kenner weapon :lol:

Click to expand...

I agree with you there Lars, but I just dont have the patience or skills to take it to the next level. Even with the guides I really struggle categorising my blasters

Click to expand...

I have not walked all the line out yet on weapon variants. But I would not buy a lili ledy, toltoys, top toys, takara, glasslite, poch, pbp or meccano without the correct weapon variant unless I have an extra.

It also takes a lot of time to learn about them and I do not have time to learn that much about it. Maybe when I get more time or get older :lol:

I also think it is funny when you get the same character on a hong kong and a taiwan moc then the weapons is not always the same on some characters.

I just don't have the time to categorising most of my blasters so I am pretty sure many of my kenner figures have wrong Variants of weapons :lol: Maybe some also was sold with different weapons. But I am learning from childhood lots also. When I find the same variant again and again with the same weapon variant.

I totally understand why many collectors do not have the patience or skills to take it to the next level. It is not always easy and it takes a lot of time.

I work on the rule of thumb of trying to display my loose figures how they were intentionally released by their manufacturer. So where PBP figures were carded with unique PBP blasters beit raised bar or metallic or whatever, then that is what they are displayed with, not kenner variants of the same type. Same goes for Ledy, Glasslite, etc etc.
Also if figures came with a different weapon in a different line, I roll with that too, As an example, The PBP Han hoth figure on PBP cards was released with an imperial blaster, as opposed to a rebel blaster, Also, YPS stormtrooper et al.
I don't think there's any need to tie specific weapon mould sculpts to any particular figures COO, As that would never have been an aim of the manufacturer.
I think the only real requirement that we should all live by is to NOT use repro stuff.

edd_jedi said:

Well the first thing you have to remember is that all of this stuff is completely made up by collectors in recent years. There was no such thing as a v blaster 5 years ago, or a family mould 2 years ago. I'm not saying they serve no purpose, but they are fan-made, that's a fact. Kenner themselves did not use any of these naming conventions.

Click to expand...

Thanks Edd for that, I thought it was only me...
I have been away from the collecting scene for 16 years, and am overwhelmed by the detail that collectors go into now, especially with loose figures.
There was no coo, no that weapon is the wrong colour blue or other minor variations, just "thats a nice figure with the right weapon".
I have found it hard to get upto speed with the loose figure side of the hobby now in 2017, what with the depth that collectors analyse every detail, but intresting none the less, I was always a MOC collector and still am.
So to try to get a grasp on loose collecting, I bought a loose Bobba Fett, and looked at a reference guide on here to try to identify what kind of Fett it was, it blew me away that there were so many variations.
I think I have it down to two or three, but to be honest in the end I gave up and found that I didn't care, and was pleased that I now owned a nice Bobba Fett with a weapon of the right shape, that's all I really cared about.
But please don't get me wrong, if that is what floats your boat then great, it's a good thing that we are all different and get different things from the same hobby.
Just enjoy the chase.

For me the key to a legitimate variant is that it 1) had to be deliberate and 2) there has to be a reason for it. Somebody the other day asked me why cardback variations are any different from weapon or figure variants. Yes there are lots of different cardbacks, 12a/b/c, 70a/b/c/d etc, but there is a good reason those exist.

Take the 12 back. The reason the 12b came about is because somebody or some people at Kenner thought the text on the back about the lightsabre was not descriptive enough to explain how to use the figure. So they reviewed, approved and changed it. This is the case for every cardback - they were either correcting a mistake, or adding new products, or adding a barcode, etc.

And sure, the same can be said for some figure variants - large/small head, vinyl/cloth cape etc. Those are proper production changes, and therefore variants. But look at most supposed figure or weapon variants. Do you really think people at Kenner sat around a table and said "Let's make the angle on this blaster barrel slightly different and call it a V5." Or "let's use a slightly shinier paint on Bossk in Spain." Of course they bloody didn't! They just used whatever green paint they had in the factory that day.

And that is my view on variants.

I have started seeing these things pop up on FB - "the correct blaster for xxx" - it also seems to be combined with an inflated price for said weapon - for example the translucent Blue/Black Rebel Blaster being the 'correct' weapon for the Blue Snaggletooth - and sold for $45!.

Now I really do commend those that have the patience to go through these things and the knowledge that the variant collectors have is amazing. However for such a statement to be true then I would need to know that EVERY factory sealed example of that figure is packed with that weapon

This is similar to the old 'no-bump' Jawa Blaster - which for years was the only blaster accepted for a VC Jawa - or at least it was until packaged examples were shown to have both

For me - without proof then this is just another of people trying to maximize the most money that they can get out of this hobby

I think it's a bit harsh to say 'made up', I agree that Kenner didn't call these accessories a 'v5' or a 'v whatever', but this is a term which collectors have adopted themselves to identify the different sculpts.

Take for example Wollf's excellent COO guide, the example below shows the IG-88 figure...

http://swspaceclub.com/wbobafett/coo-guide-3-0/esb/ig-88/#a

Note they have been split up into 3 families, each with a unique COO marking and likewise each with a unique sculpt as shown in Alex's mould family guide...

http://www.imperialgunneryforum.com/t6958-the-mould-family-guide-discussion-thread#esb_ig_88

So why is this? well it's a common theory that each factory produced there own tooling and in doing so each set of tooling was unique in some form or another, as with the IG-88 figure someone thought the figure would be easier to make without hollow tubes, someone else thought it would be easier to make it without the pipes on the side of the leg.

So there we have 3 factories making uniquely sculpted figures, so what goes with each figure? That's right accessories. So again is a common theory that each factory made their own tooling for each accessory.

Whilst we may never known that went on in these far eastern factories there is plenty of evidence to back up coo families, to cards which have unique factory codes on them. However it's only until recently that variant collectors are now trying to piece together the correct sculpt (v number) accessory to the correct figure.

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Just remember guys, did the factory give a toss about what card stock they used for card backs, or what size bubble wasused?....

"They just used whatever XXXXXX they had in the factory that day."

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...and please don't bring up any of the discoloured plastics or unpainted limb stuff, that's just a load of bollocks. If some people want to collect that stuff fine, I wouldn't give it shelf space in my worst enemies house.

For variant collectors who have a passion for it, I fully understand it, doff my cap to them. Therefore this creates a market that will be " utilised" by sellers. Again it would be a case of if its a variant collector buying the item to fit their collection then all good, they are willing to pay what it is worth to them. Then it does preclude the budget buyers, but the vintage collecting world changes as do all things in life, I got a coffee and a cake from a well known outlet which I havnt frequented before a while back, won't be doing that again...how much :shock: :lol:

Different weapon 'moulds' have been acknowledged for more than 5 years: http://forum.rebelscum.com/showthread.php?t=1002553
http://forum.rebelscum.com/showthread.php?t=1000627

Figure mould families 'generally' match the factory code on cardbacks, cardback 'labelling' is even expanding, 48D for example now acknowledges the different text adding 48E & F , 48 G adds to 48A http://www.12back.com/features/cardbacks/cardbacks.php3


edit: I do agree people do get carried away and sellers using 'fluffy' descriptions and inaccurately claiming items to be rare variants are a pain.