The Last Jedi - **SPOILERS THREAD**

It certainly looks like Disney have stepped in at points with Star Wars, look what happened with Gareth Edwards, the lego directors and the ep 9 director. I think they keep a close eye on this franchise as it's so mainstream and profitable for them, same with Marvel. They also realise there are other markets out there like pulp Fiction as you mention but these are not directly associated with Disney, hence putting them out under the Miramar name.

I do think Rhian Johnson was pretty much left alone with ep 8 as there was never really any bad press put out there about him, infant I don't remember hearing any problems with ep 8 (except for Mark Hamil lol). Disney were probably happy with Rhian's script and as mentioned before it looks like they were finically right. I still think though that Disney will step in when they don't think things are quite right for them (mentioned above with the 4 directors who were all replaced or not allowed to have complete control). It's so much money they're dealing with and they certainly don't want their franchise to fail or have no future. That was one of the things that I did like about TLJ though, the fact that they took the story in an unexpected way. It may not have worked for some people but at least no one can say that it's just a copy of ESB.

Ian

I loved this movie. Very little to complain about. Will write my thoughts soon. Far better than the predicatable TFA. This movie took a lot of guts to approve and make. I didn't want ESB or another Death Star Planet

Richard_H said:

I loved this movie. Very little to complain about. Will write my thoughts soon. Far better than the predicatable TFA. This movie took a lot of guts to approve and make. I didn't want ESB or another Death Star Planet

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I'm with you on that Richard for my first screening of it, I'm off to see it tomorrow for my sons Birthday with 3 of his mates so I'll let people know if I feel any different after.

Ian.

Whichever way you look at this movie there a lot of Star Wars fans that have been left disappointed and the people who liked it should acknowledge that, the same way the disappointed fans should acknowledge that a lot liked it too. Despite it's shortcomings I think we can all agree it's better than the prequels, but nowhere near the OT!

Andyclarke said:

Whichever way you look at this movie there a lot of Star Wars fans that have been left disappointed and the people who liked it should acknowledge that, the same way the disappointed fans should acknowledge that a lot liked it too. Despite it's shortcomings I think we can all agree it's better than the prequels, but nowhere near the OT!

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That works for me and I certainly don't want to argue with anyone about it as I can easily see both sides to this film. I think I've lost interest in really caring about the product that's post George but can still get enjoyment out of it. Everyone has their own opinions about movies which I'm happy with as it means there's something for everyone out there.

Ian

Grant_C said:

Do any of you guys think you would like the original trilogy if it was released now. Ignoring any obvious ageing?

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Personally, yes.

I raw, gritty way in which the OT was made. Unfortunately because of huge leaps in technology movies are not 'made' anymore, they are designed. I remember Lucas once said that he would have loved to have had the effects of today back then but he didn't and the movie was better for it. Hand built sets, painted backdrops are what made the OT.

I wouldn't say Disney are directly responsible for the sequels but they had a hand in it. Its a cash cow to them., they are a business and they don't care who they upset or what they destroy. Abrams and Johnson have both proved to be terrible film makes, but that's just my own opinion. Even now after more viewings, the Leia scene makes me wince.

Its been a week now for me and my initial reaction hasn't improved, if anything, I dislike the film even more.

I can understand that Disney want to have a clean slate to make their own movies without being tied to whats already out there - and thats the reason for killing everyone off (as much as I dont like it) so I'm going to list my points as a non star wars fan. I also didnt like the forced humour, ropey CG on Yoda and the terrible design of the casino planet but those are subjective and others may have enjoyed it. The less said about super leia the better.

As a sequel (and one from a studio that specialises in interconnected films) the main point of this one is to continue the story set up in Force Awakens. Unfortunately a lot of the plot points set up in its prequel are just not answered or thrown away for the sake of an unfunny gag.

Who is Snoke? This was the big question on everyones lips and his screen time here (whilst excellently played by Serkis and his animators) doesnt deliver on that question they baited us for two years about. Who are Reys parents? TFA makes out this is a big deal since her inner conflict is all about them returning, they must be important to her and therefore to the plot. But they are just brushed aside as a couple of junkies by Kylo Ren - what an anticlimax. Ah but what if he's lying? Well he might be but do we really need to wait 3 movies to find this out?
The most criminal of these is the Lightsabre scene at the very end of TFA. This scene was great and the look on Lukes face when he was presented with it had so much feeling in it we all thought the follow up would be spectacular. But he just tosses it over his shoulder and milks a dugong. Why?

So these three follow up scenes are a letdown but perhaps it works as a standalone film? So at the end of the day, what's about?

Is it a story of how Rey seeks out Luke to train to be a jedi? Not really since Luke doesnt train her as such and theres no real struggle but she still gets super powerful. The heroes journey without all the middle bits.

Is it about Kylo's conflict between the light and the dark? Well yes is it and these scenes were the ones I enjoyed although theres no real payout from them like we had with Vader in ROTJ. He's just a bad guy and even when he does do a good deed (not blowing up his mum) she gets blown up anyway.

Is it about Lukes showdown with his former pupil? Not really since this scene happens right at the end and has no consequences since luke isnt there (this was obvious from him surviving the bombardment and using the same lightsabre that just got destroyed).

Phasma's revenge on Finn? Nope, she gets no screen time to set this up and just has a scrap with him which she wins and then doesnt.

All good films have a point to them, TFA, whilst a retread of ANH, is clear about whats going on, but I was lost throughout this one as nothing really meant anything as people kept dying before their story was resolved or the plot was just dropped.

So if the film doesnt really have a major plot that means the main story is a chase movie, but they're supposed to be exciting....

Nice post by Gus Lopez earlier that made me chuckle...

Finally a comparison, I think A New Hope is the best one! :lol:

:lol:

Was thinking about writing a review myself.

Why doesn't the blockade running just go into hyperspace when Vader is chasing it? Its not like Vader couldn't track it through hyperspace? :?

Not really sure if Gus post was supposed to be ironic as most of his points aren't really film breaking plot holes or even issues at all. Nevertheless I tried to write my review irrespective of those sort of issues and focus on the problems I see with the storytelling and plot - or lack of both in this case.

Definitely give it another go.

I hated it the first 2 showings. Hated it. Nothing made sense and Luke didn't go Jedi Master mental.

I think its the third best one now.

Gus's review made me laugh and makes for a good comparison (even if they did push it a bit further in TLJ). I'm off to see it again for my sons Birthday today so I'll see how I feel the second go around.

One other small point is that I've seen some complaining about the way the CG Yoda looked but if you look at this I think they did their best to recapture the ESB one 8)


https://www.cbr.com/star-wars-last-jedi-puppet-yoda/


https://scifi.stackexchange.com/questions/176843/in-the-last-jedi-how-was-this-character-filmed

Ian

Well I'm in a happy place with my SW love - didn't really like TFA but daughter loved it so I went along with it and enjoyed it through her even buying the modern OT characters like Ackbar and Solo.
This time however I really disliked the film and much to my surprise (and delight) so did my wife and daughter.

Absolutely delighted that so many people have enjoyed it but as I said at the start my SW fandom is much clearer now - I am an OT guy for sure and that's all I need. Had a wee purge of the TFA figures and my collection feels better for it.
I won't be bothering with the Solo film or Episode 9 just like I don't bother with the Marvel films - for me they are all the same thing now.

The collecting universe is a big old place with room for everyone shame but inevitable that differing opinions can sometimes bring out a bit too much emotion but that's the world we live in.

Right I'm off to watch ESB as it makes me feel 8 again and excited about snow speeders and Walkers on my Santa list - much better than the jaded grumpy 45 year old bastard watching TLJ

Cheers 8)

I really don't have a problem with people moaning about the new films, I used to and some of the reasons people give sometimes I find frustrating. But Star Wars is such a personal thing for us origional trilogy fans, I completely understand why some get so frustrated and vent their anger.

That is half the problem, we all have our own idea what a Star Wars film should be about and although they are all different, we all pretty much want another ESB, which isn't going to happen. One thing I do think is TLJ has made it very easy for fans to complain about, which is disappointing.

theforceuk said:

I really don't have a problem with people moaning about the new films, I used to and some of the reasons people give sometimes I find frustrating. But Star Wars is such a personal thing for us origional trilogy fans, I completely understand why some get so frustrated and vent their anger.

That is half the problem, we all have our own idea what a Star Wars film should be about and although they are all different, we all pretty much want another ESB, which isn't going to happen. One thing I do think is TLJ has made it very easy for fans to complain about, which is disappointing.

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Some of the comments have been completely bizarre, not on here particularly, but elsewhere on social media. It goes from just plain daftness, to completely made up stuff to abuse and everything in between. It's bonkers. The only thing I've seen that's been worse recently has been the female Doctor Who crisis :lol:

Nothing will ever replace the nostalgia of the OT for me, but each to their own like you say.

Well i've just got back from my second screening of it and have to say that I still really enjoyed it. I had tears in my eyes with excitement 4 times throughout it and even found most of the humour didn't really feel that out of place. I didn't even mind the Leia Marry Poppins part too much, although I think this is due to that first shot that just lingers on her motionless face, it's really nicely shot and lit and forgave a bit of the strangeness of seeing her float back into the ship. There's also another great shot of Leia I liked when you first see her on Crate, she has her collar up and you can just see her eyes, now that's the Princess I remember for the OT!

All in all I just found it entertaining and exciting (especially the last third), and even though there are parts that could well have been written better it didn't really spoil the film for me. Even the Canto Bight section which most people seem to really dislike I didn't mind for the fact that it did remind me of the Prequels. The OT works amazingly on it's own and I can understand why for some fans this is where the story ends, but if you want to go further into this universe then you have to accept at least some of the prequels (we can all pick and choose which parts). This Canto Bight section worked as a bridge for me between the OT and Prequels so it didn't really bother me.

I can see all the problems that people are saying (it's not like they're easy to miss), but they really don't bother me that much, I'm happy to just be entertained at this point as I grew up with the OT and will always have those memories of what Star Wars means to me from that time.

Ian

Palifan said:

Even the Canto Bight section which most people seem to really dislike I didn't mind for the fact that it did remind me of the Prequels.

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Ehh, you LIKE being reminded of the prequels? :shock:

Pretty sure that's banning behaviour :wink: :lol:

[youtube]EIY-PsHrj9A[/youtube]

I know you can do some fancy thing to embed the clip but I'm in a lazy mood :lol:


MOD EDIT, Yeah tricky, took me all of 4 seconds! If I can do it, it really can't be that tricky.

Weaz.

Fixed it for you.