Gift option replaced by "Family and friends" option?

This was probably covered somewhere but I can't think where, does anyone know how to send gift payments so that you can cover the fee as the sender so the person receiving the funds gets the full amount?

The only options I have are:

-I'm paying for goods or services
-I'm sending money to family or friends

The first one says I won't pay a fee and the seller does, the second one says I don't pay a fee if I have money in my account but do if I use my bank card/cc linked to paypal.

Only asking because I just sent $500 to an American account, had the funds in my account and he now wants the $19.80 he ate in fees (I was not told he would pay any fees..)..

Any suggestions/help guys?

This is a bit of a strange one. I have sent many payments since they have changed to friends and family. So far no one has come back to me asking for the fee's so I assume it didnt incur any and I didnt pay many to send them either whether I had money in my PP account or using my bank to fund payment. I have sent 2 payments to Todd recently using friends and family and even though I had money in my Paypal account it charges 1% i think for the overseas transaction. Todd didnt say if he paid fee's on it his end.

'family & friends' replaced 'gift' a while ago. I use a credit card & Paypal always states what extra I pay (fees) & 'seller x' will receive 'x' amount. No one has complained yet about fees on their end :!:

I assumed the family and friends option was basically a gift payment and because I had funds in my paypal account the fee was zero (as it does state sending money from your balance is free) yet they are telling me they got hit with fees.

Actually I had this same issue late last year or early this year with a guy in Australia, I kept sending gift payments to him and they kept charging him a fee to receive it, I was again using funds in my paypal account. I argued with them through email and they basically gave me the finger and said tough. Even got me to get a refund + resend it and it still did it but they wouldn't refund him the fees. After the 10th email they said they needed to confirm I was the account holder (???) so I told them that if they needed to do that why ask 10 emails replies after my initial email? Demanded a reply and got none! Wankers.

I haven't actually bought anything since then so I had forgotten about this change so I am guessing the same **** has happened again. Asked for a screenshot anyways to see what he can see his side with regard to the option I used + the fees he was charged.

Yes very strange. I recently made a large purchase from overseas using the friends and family payment option and it wanted to deduct the 3.4% even though I had the money in my linked current account. I just transfered the money to my paypal account first which was fairly easy and instantaneous and then I was able to make the transfer with only 1% fees which I believe is standard for international transfers.

It gave the option for the recipient to pay fees (I select no) and always advises the exact ammount the recipient will receive.

@Joe....double check the exchange rates which paypal have used, if you've paid USD and they've taken GBP'f from your account maybe that's were the missing $19.80 is, it's happened to me several times.

Don't ask why but paypal's exchange rate is rubbish!!!

They take a fee from you for currency conversion if you use gift payment. That's apart from the conversion rates.

Here are the details of the transaction, again I get no option to pay fees it only advises me that if I use my paypal balance I wont pay any? lol

(screenshot of the option I chose attached too)

Amount sent:
-$500.00 USD (equals -£336.38 GBP)
Fee amount:
$0.00 USD
Net amount:
-$500.00 USD

Conversion from:
-£336.38 GBP
Conversion to:
$500.00 USD
Exchange rate:
1 British Pound = 1.4864 US Dollars

Date:
27 Jun 2013
Time:
12:37:48 BST
Status:
Completed

Subject:
*Edit*
Funding Type:
PayPal Balance
Payment Method:
£336.38 GBP – PayPal Account

Oh and if you choose this option and click continue the "I will pay the fee" box is already ticked so the only way to put the fee on the other guy is to untick it..(however on the $00 transaction there was no fee box to tick or untick after clicking continue because I had a paypal balance!!)

I think the only real answer to all of this is that Paypal are ****wits.

walkie said:

@Joe....double check the exchange rates which paypal have used, if you've paid USD and they've taken GBP'f from your account maybe that's were the missing $19.80 is, it's happened to me several times.

Don't ask why but paypal's exchange rate is rubbish!!!

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Capetown said:

They take a fee from you for currency conversion if you use gift payment. That's apart from the conversion rates.

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Sorry I replied before I saw these, ok that might be it then. I had GBP and sent in USD. So they not only give you a shitty exchange rate (not identical to xe.com) but they also charge you $20 for changing the money over? lol

Wow.

Joe, yeah the exchange rate is shocking compared to xe.com!!

I've sent many payment via friends & family & never had this Joe & have sent using my GBP funds but stated the amount in USD, they are robbing you, I would get on to them to remedy the situation & if no joy try making a new account see if that gets rid of the problem, but as we all know PP are thieving goits

I'm glad it's not just me that thinks this is retarded! Why they do this and don't make you aware that the recipient will pay fees on the money you send I will never understand, they could at least give you the option to pay it yourself. It ultimately costs me anyway as the last time this happened I think I had to send a further $45 to cover the original fees and a bit more to cover fees on the $40..

Like I said I did try to contact them before and they were just full of excuses, will email again but I doubt I will get anywhere.

As annoying as this is, and i really don't understand how or why this has happened, i send money internationally all the time and never heard of this, still, i don't see how it's your problem. Any fees this guy might receive due to paypal ripping him off is his problem and for him to take up with paypal. As your images show, it was nothing at your end. You did everything you were supposed to do and did not transfer any fee on to the receiver. I'd tell him he needs to take it up with paypal.

PGowdy said:

As annoying as this is, and i really don't understand how or why this has happened, i send money internationally all the time and never heard of this, still, i don't see how it's your problem. Any fees this guy might receive due to paypal ripping him off is his problem and for him to take up with paypal. As your images show, it was nothing at your end. You did everything you were supposed to do and did not transfer any fee on to the receiver. I'd tell him he needs to take it up with paypal.

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Good advice from Pete there, you did what was called for, so its only fair he should help out.

Frunkstar said:

PGowdy said:

As annoying as this is, and i really don't understand how or why this has happened, i send money internationally all the time and never heard of this, still, i don't see how it's your problem. Any fees this guy might receive due to paypal ripping him off is his problem and for him to take up with paypal. As your images show, it was nothing at your end. You did everything you were supposed to do and did not transfer any fee on to the receiver. I'd tell him he needs to take it up with paypal.

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Good advice from Pete there, you did what was called for, so its only fair he should help out.

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Yeah this is kind of how I feel, I know it's probably a paypal issue but they fobbed me off with so much BS last time it happened (when the gift option was actually still there- yet it still cost the seller fees) and tried to make me sound like a moron that stuffed the payment up that I just gave up as they wouldn't discuss it further over email without me phoning to prove I was the account holder. Sure, I probably should have called but I bet they would have made me wait on hold for half the day + charged me for the privilege and they may not have even been able to help so I just said **** it and continued emailing but never got a reply..

Here was the discussion last time and the excuses they tried:

PAYPAL said:

Thank you for contacting PayPal regarding the payment you have sent to ##### for the amount of 500.00USD.

I can see why you are concerned as the person you have sent the funds to has been charged a fee when they received the funds in to their account.
Looking further in to your account I can see that you have sent the payment as a service payment and not as a gift Mr O'Brien.

The fee they have been charged was 17.30USD on the transaction.

Our fees are the same for all accounts. We charge fees when:
You receive money from a purchase
You receive payments from outside your country or region
You send personal payments using a credit card. The sender determines who pays the fee
Transaction fees can range from 1.4% to 3.4% + 20p. If you receive a payment from outside the UK, an additional cross-border fee may apply.
It's free to pay for a purchase, or make a personal transfer using money from your PayPal balance or your bank account.
Here's how to see the fees currently being applied to your account:
Go to http://www.paypal.co.uk and log in to your account.
Click 'Auction Tools' near the top of the page.
From the list of links on the left side of the page, select 'Transaction fees'.
Under 'Receiving Purchase payments', you'll see the fees currently being applied to your account.
Here's how to view fees applied to a particular payment:
Go to http://www.paypal.co.uk and log in to your account.
Click 'History' near the top of the page.
Find the desired payment and click 'Details.'
Here's how to see a list of all our fees:
Go to http://www.paypal.co.uk and log in to your account.
Click 'Fees' at the bottom of the page.

Thank you for your time.

Yours sincerely,
Jane

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ME said:

I very much appreciate your email which details what has happened, I am 100% sure I sent that and another payment as a gift, I triple checked in fact..- I have never sent a payment as a service payment and I am sure you can see how many times I have sent gift payments using my paypal balance and see that it is quite normal for me to do so.

Is there anything you can do about the 17.30 USD that was charged and also the fee that was charged on this transaction: Unique Transaction ID ###########

I would very much appreciate any advise on how to recover those charges as I have inconvenienced the recipient of the funds a little and as I said, I am 100% sure I sent the money as a gift.

Thank you

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PAYPAL said:

Thank you for contacting PayPal regarding fees which have been applied to your 500.00 USD transaction, Please allow me to assist you further.



As frustrating as it sounds, There is no way to reverse the fee of 17.30 USD. One way around this is to get the payment refunded and re-send it again as a Gift payment.



Please let us know if you require any further assistance.

Yours sincerely,
Cyril

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Hi Cyril,

I had thought of that myself but you see I think it would just happen again, I had everything set to gift when I sent the funds, I know this because gifts are all I ever send unless paying for items through online stores like ebay and the service payment option is just something I have never used (never even taken notice of it till your colleague mentioned it)..on both payments I made sure I clicked the second tab (personal) and left the "gift" option ticked.

I purposely double checked the second amount I sent as I was alerted to the fact that the recipient had been charged for the inital transaction.

I honestly believe that an error has occurred and would appreciate it if you could try to replicate this to see what happens your end.

As I said, after sending two gift payments that were charged for no reason I am not going to get the funds refunded and send them again only to have the recipient charged a third time.

I would appreciate a better outcome after all these years of using paypal without any issues if possible.

Joe

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PAYPAL said:

Thank you for contacting PayPal regarding a fee paid on a payment sent to #######. I have reviewed this payment and can confirm that this was sent as a 'Service,' payment. This would result in a receiving fee and if the account holder is outside of the UK a cross border fee.



I understand that when making this payment you choose the personal tab to ensure this was a gift payment, however I would advise that if you had chosen this tab and then changed an amount or the email address this may have returned the payment type back to the default which is a purchase payment. This would then explain why this payment had been sent in this way. As there is no way for us to reverse this fee I would advise the following, to ask the received of the payment to refund the payment which will in turn cancel the payment and the fee and for you to attempt the payment again using the below process, ensuring this shows as a gift payment before the completing of the transaction. If this then does happen again, this will show that a problem may exist and we can investigate this further.



I appreciate that you have paid this person 2 separate amounts which have both been sent as 'Service,' payments, if you are able to ask for one to be refunded and attempt this again, this would be greatly appreciated.



As noted, please enter the email address and amount prior to choosing the 'Personal,' tab to ensure it is sent in this way.



To send money:

1. Log in to your PayPal account at http://www.paypal.co.uk .
2. Click 'Send Money' near the top of the page.
3. Enter the email address of the recipient and the amount and currency of the payment.
4. Choose the option that describes why you're sending money. Choosing the Personal tab and the option for money owed for example.
5. Click 'Continue'.
6. Review your payment details including the payment method and currency. To change any information, click the 'change' link in the relevant section. Note: If you change any payment details, the payment method will automatically return to your default method of payment.

Therefore if any changes are made, review this to ensure it is a Personal payment owed and has not changed back to a purchase payment.


7. Review your postage information and add a message to the recipient (optional).
8. Click 'Send Money' to complete the payment.



I trust that this will resolve your query.

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ME said:

Hi again,

I am afraid you are trying to imply that I am to blame for the fees that the recipient has incurred and that is simply untrue.

If I were to use your example of me changing the details of the transaction, the page would have gone back to default - the default payment option is NOT "services" it is - "Goods" and if I had proceeded with goods it would have shown this on my final page.

I did not change the transaction details, I copied the email in - did not manually type it and the amount I sent was known from before I began the transaction, I did not alter this amount.

For me the simplest outcome and the one that would show me that you cared about your customers would be to cover the funds incurred by the recipient on these two transactions and for them to receive the funds directly, I am no longer sending or receiving funds with this person and I do not wish to ask for a refund only to have the same thing happen again.

Please pass this option on to your management as I believe it is by far the fairest option considering the circumstances, this is definitely an error on your part and not human error, like I said even if I had done what you have suggested with the altering email/amount the payment screen would not have been set to "services".

Joe

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PAYPAL said:

Thank you for taking the time to contact PayPal again regarding the payments you have sent to Georgette Nasrallah.

For security reasons, we're unable to answer all enquiries we receive by email. In these circumstances, to maintain the integrity of an account, we need to make sure we're speaking directly to the account holder. To assist you with your issue, we recommend contacting us by telephone and we will be more than happy to help you.

Our customer support telephone line (087 07 307 191) is open from 8am to 10pm Monday to Friday, from 8am to 9pm on Saturdays and from 9am to 9pm on Sunday. It is a national call rate of 10p per minute from a UK landline phone. Rates from overseas landlines and mobile phones may vary.

To speak securely about your account you will be asked for a Customer Service PIN or a one-off passcode to confirm your identity. This ensures that we speak only with the account holder and that sensitive account information is not given to a third party.

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ME said:

Hi again,

I think it is unfortunate and slightly coincidental that the previous 3 emails we have exchanged have not required you to verify if I am the account holder yet when I ask for this to be resolved you suddenly need to, I believe you are passing the buck now which is really unfair.

I will speak to the recipient and ask him if a refunded payment is at all possible and I will send the funds again if they agree but if my payment yet again is charged their side and fees deducted I will expect all fees for all transactions to be covered by yourselves, I know it's possible for you to do it's just that at the moment you would rather me believe it was my fault and not have to send them yourselves.

If you helpline had been free I would have called to verify that I am indeed the account holder but I will not call and have to stay on the line for however long it takes to resolve this issue while it costs me money to do so especially after all the money you have taken off of me for fees and currency conversions over the years.

I honestly thought you would have the decency to take care of this issue which I stress again is entirely not my fault.

Joe

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No reply...

ME said:

Hi,

As per my last email I have had the $500 refunded and I have sent it again as a gift, I have included screenshots to show you that yet again I selected gift yet on the final payment screen there is no tick box to show who pays the fees for me to tick or untick, it just says "your total charge - $500". I have not changed the amount mid transaction nor have I changed or edited the address, the option of services was not selected (these were your assumptions for why the recipient paid fees on the amount sent)

I am more than sure that the recipient has again been charged the fee which I told you would happen but you didn't believe me..

As you suggested the refund and resending was the only thing that could be done before you investigate, I would like you now to investigate this issue as clearly there is a problem.

Joe

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Again no reply..

I'm actually going to call tomorrow at some point about the old case and the new one and see what they say, ****ing disgrace they really are.

(For those that read RS, I feel a little like "Dan" right now...battling the evil company!)

That's an odd one Joe. I've not had any issues with gifting the folks in the USA - but I only ever use card, and never paypal balance. The guy recieving needs to look into why he's being charged fees.


Nick

You're right Joe, Paypal are indeed ****wits. Greedy ****wits at that. Hope it all works out for you, although as others have suggested you are able to prove you have paid the full amount, so surely it is up to the seller to fight it out with Paypal over why they have shafted him.

Capetown said:

They take a fee from you for currency conversion if you use gift payment. That's apart from the conversion rates.

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Correct ^^^
I have used this a few times recently !