UKG reject Palitoy BSG - Buyer now wants refund!!

chazb73

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Some of you will be aware that I sold My 30a Palitoy BSG recently

The seller sent an email when it arrived saying he was very happy - all well and good.
Funds were then used for their intened purpose after this.

Got an email today stating that he had sent it to be graded (AFA :twisted: ) and had received an email from them stating that it would not be graded as there were pen marks found under UV light. He now wants a refund.....

He asked me before the sale if the figure had been "touched up with ink" I scrutinised the card - there were no touch-ups as far as I could see (I was looking for tears or grazes that had been inked).In fact there were no pens marks on the card that I could see.

I'm unsure what to do - had he not been looking for a grade everything would have been fine.
I'm aware that ebay tend to side on the buyer :evil: but we don't have the cash now to refund.

He hasn't left feedback on my account and its within the 45 days - (more than 3 weeks have passed)

I'm concerned that paypal will remove money from our account can they do that? (mortgage money!!) if they side with the buyer (probably will) if it comes to a case. And how do I know it's not a scam?

Concerned :(
 

Lee77

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Sorry to hear that. It's not always easy to spot marker pen touch ups. I think afa use a black or uv light that shows them up.
Has he asked for a part or full refund? Unless he's being unreasonable, that's probably the best route as eBay will class it as 'item not as described' and probably find in his favour.
Regarding it being a scam, if he's got an email from afa saying its been touched up, I'd say he's being genuine. The only thing is, maybe he touched it up himself. But why would he then send it for grading when it'll obviously get picked up on.
Good luck on this but I reckon a part refund is probably the best outcome.
Try and get some pictures and make sure that its definitely the one you sold that's been rejected and not one that the buyer already had. Was there any marks on yours that would make it stand out from another?

Good luck.
 

chazb73

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Cheers Lee

Yes there are some distinguishing marks which were pointed out. I think he is genuine enough, but a copy of the email from AFA would be a good idea.
 

browny

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Sounds a bit suspect to me that he asked that "specific" question and then that was the exact cause that got it declined...!

Maybe he had one already that had pen marks? Just a thought mate,check both sets of pictures very carefully here :)

A well "respected" former member on here done something similar to me with a Han hoth that had shot out the end of the bubble,he told me before he purchased it that it was to replace a "smashed bubble han hoth" of exact cardback and quality,you know where I am going with this mate!!

Anyway I had to give him a refund because he was holding me to ransom.. :roll: :roll:
 

escapist

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Surely a claim would be unsuccessful? Your original listing said made no mention of it being any sort of grade or even 'AFA-gradable'.

Surely he'd have to demonstrate to Paypal that the item received a few weeks ago was received in the same condition its was sent in, which would be improbably given that its travelled halfway round the world and back to get an attempted grade!?!
 

escapist

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I said surely a lot back then. Surely.

Another thing, is the AFA particularly protective about data. Could you maybe ping them an e-mail in the meantime to ask if they rejected a BSG due to pen marks. Surely they don't get too many of those in??

Also, is pen a failable offence? Why don't they just knock down the grade of the card? Man made dents and cracks get graded don't they?
 

chazb73

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escapist said:
I said surely a lot back then. Surely.

Another thing, is the AFA particularly protective about data. Could you maybe ping them an e-mail in the meantime to ask if they rejected a BSG due to pen marks. Surely they don't get too many of those in??

Also, is pen a failable offence? Why don't they just knock down the grade of the card? Man made dents and cracks get graded don't they?

It's a good point bud - I never stated it was AFA gradable - How can I state something which cannot be seen with the naked eye .

here's my listing

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/271145908020?ssPageName=STRK:MESOX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1561.l2649
 

Richard_H

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Come on those pen marks are as obvious as hell!


You can see them in the top left corner. Or is it the bottom right? Or on the back? Or..... :lol:
 

jedi_masters

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I think you need a lot more info from this guy than just his word saying AFA refused it due to touch ups.

Get him to send you a copy of the email AFA sent him.

A picture of the figure YOU sent him with the picture circled where the touch ups supposedly are.

And a front on pic of the figure so you can be certain the figure was your one.
 

itfciain

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This is a tough one - AFA fail for ink as they see it as restoration

We WILL NOT grade any item which exhibits the following:
•Restoration defined as any foreign and permanent addition to an item (examples include ink or paint used to cover

http://www.toygrader.com/grading_eligible.aspx

I would certainly ask for a copy of the report and to see pictures of the card. I do think that Ebay will find in his favour and therefore you will go into negative in paypal. If you cancel any direct debit that you have with paypal then they can not claim that money but you will obviously not be able to use that account again - and probably the Ebay account connected with it

Have you discussed partial refund with the buyer ?
 

chazb73

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itfciain said:
This is a tough one - AFA fail for ink as they see it as restoration

We WILL NOT grade any item which exhibits the following:
•Restoration defined as any foreign and permanent addition to an item (examples include ink or paint used to cover

http://www.toygrader.com/grading_eligible.aspx

I would certainly ask for a copy of the report and to see pictures of the card. I do think that Ebay will find in his favour and therefore you will go into negative in paypal. If you cancel any direct debit that you have with paypal then they can not claim that money but you will obviously not be able to use that account again - and probably the Ebay account connected with it

Have you discussed partial refund with the buyer ?

Hi Iain

Sent emails earlier asking for pics etc and also mentioned partial refund - no reply as yet

If he is genuine then he must be dissapointed in hearing this - but he must of thought it was gradable before he sent it?? I sent him more close ups before he purchased it also.

Thanks for the info mate :wink:
 

spoons

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browny said:
Sounds a bit suspect to me that he asked that "specific" question and then that was the exact cause that got it declined...!

Maybe he had one already that had pen marks? Just a thought mate,check both sets of pictures very carefully here :)

A well "respected" former member on here done something similar to me with a Han hoth that had shot out the end of the bubble,he told me before he purchased it that it was to replace a "smashed bubble han hoth" of exact cardback and quality,you know where I am going with this mate!!

Anyway I had to give him a refund because he was holding me to ransom.. :roll: :roll:

That's shocking browny - who was it?

And without proof that AFA refused it I wouldn't refund. Just close your paypal account and they can't take the money back.

If this is a scam like browny's the AFA submission should have been a while ago and the dates won't match
 

chazb73

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Got an email back

He is not interested in a partail refund and is not "in a position to move it on"???
no mention of the pics or email I requested :?
 

Richard_H

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This has scam written all over it. I'd immediately cut off PayPal as a source to the bank and perhaps ring eBay first on the number is Chris' thread explaining what's happening
 

Lee77

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I'd email him again and say that until he sends you a copy of the email from AFA then you're not prepared to discuss a refund.
I'm sure that when a moc gets rejected for being touched up, they send you a black and white drawing with an outline of a moc showing where it's been inked. Maybe I'm wrong.
It also might not have graded as high as he wanted due to the creases and he's trying for a refund.
Or maybe he is being genuine and it has been touched up.
If I'd spent the best part of £700 on it for it to get rejected by AFA, the least I'd do is forward the letter to the person I bought it from.
 

escapist

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It's an odd one. What was the winners feedback like on eBay? Regular moc buyer? Any negs? The way you have described his emails makes this seem not quite right and like he has something to hide.
 

browny

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spoons said:
browny said:
Sounds a bit suspect to me that he asked that "specific" question and then that was the exact cause that got it declined...!

Maybe he had one already that had pen marks? Just a thought mate,check both sets of pictures very carefully here :)

A well "respected" former member on here done something similar to me with a Han hoth that had shot out the end of the bubble,he told me before he purchased it that it was to replace a "smashed bubble han hoth" of exact cardback and quality,you know where I am going with this mate!!

Anyway I had to give him a refund because he was holding me to ransom.. :roll: :roll:

That's shocking browny - who was it?

And without proof that AFA refused it I wouldn't refund. Just close your paypal account and they can't take the money back.

If this is a scam like browny's the AFA submission should have been a while ago and the dates won't match

I wont name name's mate,maybe one day I will get my revenge but not at the moment,he is a proper little prick though :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
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