Resealed figure discovery debate - G.Kurtz Palitoy VC Jawa.

theres 1 60 from the 1980 loose line and quite a few 80s

have not checked other years but dont really think many people would send in a figure to get u graded if it looked too bad unless for fun.

jees look at all those u grades from just that one year

Maybe not relevant, but Lee's mention of the ugrades, made me realize:

Whats even Funnier, is that many off those u-graded, could have been regular loose figures or AFA85 ones before They where reattached to an original Card and then u-graded.

Seems pretty likely that there Will be off those out there :lol:

jay4 said:

i wasnt goin to post this as i thought not worth it ? but after looking at pics on the evidence thread i thought maybe it was worth it
theres a black dot which is printed below the E in empire on my TT 2001/2002 han hoth gm card ,i do not have this black dot thingy on any of my other empire carded and dont recall seeing it anywhere else ? i could snap a better pic if required :wink: also ive seen some stress/blistering like this before a couple of times but no where near as bad as this is especially on a mint flat card and theres no evidence at all of it on the front so thought it also maybe worth me posting

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This is not aimed at you Jay, but your post is a good example. I think the level of panic is getting a little extreme, a black or red dot is not an indication of a fake, just a bit of dirt during printing. The wrinkled cardback is also just a wrinkled cardback

There was previous post about dark lines through the ESB logo - shop bought examples also have this.

Others have previously said that cards wouldn't be pulped for a tiny error. The previously posted C3P0s had big issues with printing (not just a dot) and these issues have not yet been seen on shop sold examples.

As yet have we seen any definite fakes other than those with iron marks? It would appear that ROTJ (particularly Fett and HT) and GM English text cards are dubious but so far the only tells are iron marks and very bad printing. Even the Bossk feet scrapes could be legit.

The Kenner comparison idea is a good one, if you scrutinise these for long enough then I'm sure similar issues will be seen - but issues that are just part of mass production

Not many solutions in this post, but hopefully it will dampen the hysteria

On the other hand - I've never seen a black dot on an Empire card either :?

Yeah I agree, Always on the Amanaman POTF that I owned they had huge stress lines behind the bubble on the back from the pressure of the bubble

The lower AFA U grades are more likely to be damaged cards though, with bashed bubbles. That's how some people justify that they've got them U graded in the first place.

A damaged bubble stands to reason to have a poor quality figure inside. A good bubble stands to have a good quality figure inside. Looking at the Farmboy the pretty bad damage for a mint figure (the bubble was undamaged), but it was on a Pal 65 back and therefore on the 'at risk' list. I think it gets a 75 grade or so, maybe 80.

I didn't post it as evidence of anything really - perhaps it got dropped on the floor in the factory and kicked or something, but it does look suspicious.

A question: Can anyone who has recollections of buying from JJ in the past (the 500 Hoth troopers or Fetts he'd sold back in the day), how much they sold for?

I think there is some inconsistency but I can't plod through 100 pages to find the 2 or 3 posts :lol:

Double post

I have been following all the posts on this thread.

I have what was a carded 45 back at at driver with the red dot next to Chewie. It is an opened card, I opened it many years ago, and it also has a price sticker on it. The strange thing about is looking at the card now is that the at at driver image looks a bit of a mess on the colour match up, almost like the old 3D? Also the bubble looks like it came off real easy as there is no tearing to the card and I still have this bubble. There also appears to be what is the pressure marks on the rear of the card. I can post some pictures tomorrow if it is of any help?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Vintage-s...nFigures_ActionFigures_JN&hash=item3a89011f8a

Anyone bidding on this? :roll: :roll:

if it was the light blue version i might have done but to be fair on him i earlier checked his completed items and hes been selling a few palitoy carded figures in the last few weeks before this all happened but seeing as his starting price is so cheap for this, he must be in the know or would have started at atleast £450

i just want to say something important to me.

i did not think the card info that i knew for years was important when i first posted it.

i then started to see it was very important and then i tried to help the collects that have been affected and to get the troth out there to help and nothing more.

at first i took a lot of heat for people that just did not believe me, it has not been easy being the whistle blower but people needed to know the truth.

i have read people saying that will not find the list and i am now getting the odd person trying to point some blame on to me , that is really unfair and reticules, myself and a few others on here have worked so hard to get the truth out for all people affected.

after 4 days of going through boxes at my warehouse i have found the list and as i have promised from the start i am making it public so all collators know what figures are affected and so this accusations can now stop and we can now dedicate our energy to pinning down what Toni has been doing with these cards for the last 20 odd years.


this is the list i got from Arthur many years ago this is the collection of cards figures bubbles that Arthur told me he has sold to Toni , it was the deal that Toni admitted to buying from Toni, the blue pen is my old working out at the time the value of some of the items and as they are in dollars i must have been looking to off load some of them in the US at the time ?.


the last few photos is a envelop with Arthurs last none address and the other photo is a page of my very old contacts list with Arthur's last phone number is on it and also another page with Toni's contact info from back all these years a go, i came across all these documents in the same box and that was all there was in this box , i do not plan to go though anymore of my boxes as i think this is all that we could have hoped for. there must have been another list of carded figures but that dose not seem to be with this list ? if i come across that other list i will also put it up but i have not seen it yet .


















well here is what you have all been wanting and you all know now what i have known for years i hope that you can see i have helped as much as i can and that everything i have said from the start is true and that everything i said i would find, tell or explain i have delivered on every time on here, i hope that will make some of the naysayers on here see i am a man of my word and have dlivered what i said i would, sorry it so long to find.


we now need to work as a real team and stick together and help each other find the links to each of the figures so we can warn others about figures that are not right and protect the figures that are not affected and are still good.

i will lave it with you collectors on here to work that one out , thanks for your continued hard work on this .

jason

lee gray said:

if it was the light blue version i might have done but to be fair on him i earlier checked his completed items and hes been selling a few palitoy carded figures in the last few weeks before this all happened but seeing as his starting price is so cheap for this, he must be in the know or would have started at atleast £450

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be interesting to see how this affects the market has anymore been said s by Toni or JJ

Guys, amazing CSI findings tonight. 12 of my 23 TT GM cards show a clearly different blacklight appearance! All my about 35 loose cards and non TT figures appear clear white under blacklight. 12 TT card are much more blueish! I took pictures but hard to photograph. Will post tomorrow. (I found one Palitoy Rotj loose card that is also bluish.)

Mattias, any idea about this?

Main reason was that I wanted to check my 2005 TT FX7 because of the odd bubble. It is also bluish btw.

Wolfgang

( perhaps not the biggest news after JJs post )

Well fook me. Good job JJ.

Nice list Ace, just to clarify, where it says for example 11 dengar german cards, does that mean just the cardback or a carded figure, it does make some sense seeing the amount of lobots and C3PO on there.

jedisearcher said:

Well fook me. Good job JJ.

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i said i had it , what i forgot was that i own so much crap its incredible and that was a lot of work to find it and its cold up there at the wear house anyway you all have what i promised

now the real work starts

jason

lee gray said:

Nice list Ace, just to clarify, where it says for example 11 dengar german cards, does that mean just the cardback or a carded figure, it does make some sense seeing the amount of lobots and C3PO on there.

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this was the list of cards figures only there was another list i remember that had all the carded figures , i remember there was no Yaks as they were very good back then and i would have remembered them but there was lost or pop up R2s and other last 17

the rest is hard to remember but there was a lot of variety and abound 12000 to 13000 carded figures.

this list is just card backs and lose figures to go on them

the bubbles are on the other lists

spoons said:

jay4 said:

i wasnt goin to post this as i thought not worth it ? but after looking at pics on the evidence thread i thought maybe it was worth it
theres a black dot which is printed below the E in empire on my TT 2001/2002 han hoth gm card ,i do not have this black dot thingy on any of my other empire carded and dont recall seeing it anywhere else ? i could snap a better pic if required :wink: also ive seen some stress/blistering like this before a couple of times but no where near as bad as this is especially on a mint flat card and theres no evidence at all of it on the front so thought it also maybe worth me posting

Click to expand...

This is not aimed at you Jay, but your post is a good example. I think the level of panic is getting a little extreme, a black or red dot is not an indication of a fake, just a bit of dirt during printing. The wrinkled cardback is also just a wrinkled cardback

There was previous post about dark lines through the ESB logo - shop bought examples also have this.

Others have previously said that cards wouldn't be pulped for a tiny error. The previously posted C3P0s had big issues with printing (not just a dot) and these issues have not yet been seen on shop sold examples.

As yet have we seen any definite fakes other than those with iron marks? It would appear that ROTJ (particularly Fett and HT) and GM English text cards are dubious but so far the only tells are iron marks and very bad printing. Even the Bossk feet scrapes could be legit.

The Kenner comparison idea is a good one, if you scrutinise these for long enough then I'm sure similar issues will be seen - but issues that are just part of mass production

Not many solutions in this post, but hopefully it will dampen the hysteria

On the other hand - I've never seen a black dot on an Empire card either :?

Click to expand...

tbh im not panicing at all im just throwing in things that are not often seen which could be specificly relevant to any cards that maybe in question from TT , of circa 140 other cards i have not one with a wrinkled rear . as for the likes of amanaman i can understand that the bubble is huge and the pressure larger

ace said:

lee gray said:

the bubbles are on the other lists

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Aren't they the 6 cartons of bubbles in the middle on the 3rd page?

Awesome J well done. It'll take some studying but at least it's something which we can work with