Just a quick point on forwarding things on

Bunglebubs said:

Regardless of how many transactions or help you have done for others Its like an insurance company you don't know how good it is until you have to make a claim and see how they deal with it.

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That's exactly your problem - you are confusing a guy doing you a favour with a paid for service. If a courier lost your item, by all means get shitty with them. Personally I think Iain was going above and beyond refunding you, I would certainly not expect him to cover the cost of an item I bought through him if it got lost or damaged, just because he's forwarding it on for you doesn't mean the transactions risk is transferred to him. It's people like you that put most off doing favours.

edd_jedi said:

Bunglebubs said:

Regardless of how many transactions or help you have done for others Its like an insurance company you don't know how good it is until you have to make a claim and see how they deal with it.

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That's exactly your problem - you are confusing a guy doing you a favour with a paid for service. If a courier lost your item, by all means get shitty with them. Personally I think Iain was going above and beyond refunding you, I would certainly not expect him to cover the cost of an item I bought through him if it got lost or damaged, just because he's forwarding it on for you doesn't mean the transactions risk is transferred to him. It's people like you that put most off doing favours.

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Could not agree more Edd. It's a risk most of the guys know and accept. This goes both ways as many have done favors for me in the past. That is what this forum is about, helping each other out. I personally only help those out that I have established friendships with over the years. Not to sound like an elitist or snob, but I just do not feel like taking a risk and helping someone out then something similar to this happens and all of a sudden my name is **** just for the mere fact I did someone a favor and the outcome was not as expected.

edd_jedi said:

Bunglebubs said:

Regardless of how many transactions or help you have done for others Its like an insurance company you don't know how good it is until you have to make a claim and see how they deal with it.

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That's exactly your problem - you are confusing a guy doing you a favour with a paid for service. If a courier lost your item, by all means get shitty with them. Personally I think Iain was going above and beyond refunding you, I would certainly not expect him to cover the cost of an item I bought through him if it got lost or damaged, just because he's forwarding it on for you doesn't mean the transactions risk is transferred to him. It's people like you that put most off doing favours.

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Hold on here, he had the item at his home, he hadn't sent it and because he lost it you think He shouldn't refund me?

Despite the fact I hadn't mentioned anything about a refund at all, that was him, I was happy to wait for him to have a look for it again and see if it turned up. This is the problem with people commenting on a conversation when they do not have all the facts.

Iain has probably helped me put together a fair amount of the carded vintage i own and done me deals on other items as well.I look forward to receiving my latest order from him and all the ones i'll be getting in the future!!!
The person who feels he has been hard done by is,in my opinion,upset at the item not having yet been found/delivered at this point but what if Iain hadn't paid for it out of HIS pocket in the first place and said item got bought whilst he was in talks with Iain would he have sent sad P.M's then?
Same outcome: no item and no loss of cash,cheers Dave.

I disagree with the fact Ian shouldn't have had to refund. It was in his possession so whether a favour was being done or not he has lost it. End of. I also think it didn't need to come on here, it was a private matter that should have stayed private. Iains rep is top notch but that is slightly unfair on BB as everyone will of course side with Iain (of course, friends would). It ends up reflecting poorly on BB and could affect future transactions on here when by the sounds of it, it shouldn't do.

Now to put a fresh perspective on it, I could easily see how an air of suspicion might waft across this situation if it was a bargain, high value item that got lost (let's say a $50 21 back fett). If it wasn't for Iains top rep the buyer could feel it hadn't actually got lost but been conveniently 'mislaid'. Assuming its a common $50 mailer that could easily be replaced (not a $50 Fett mailer for example), it clears that concern up immediately (ps I'm not in any way insinuating anything, just saying how it could have gone down).

I don't agree that iain is significantly down, the $50 mailer must still be in his possession somewhere (assuming it wasn't posted to someone in error). If it was posted to someone else in error that would be his fault entirely and not BB's, so in my opinion the only correct course of action would be to refund the money.

I guess what I'm saying is I can see BB''s point and I wanted to speak up as i don't like the idea of everyone rounding on an individual. There are always two sides. Communication was poor, etc etc. Saying that, it now all seems sorted so should be forgotten and people move on. The point has been clearly made when it comes to these 'favours', they are exactly that, but it shouldn't absolve the person doing the favour of all responsibility. I'd suggest maybe just offering this service to very close friend's in future.

EDIT: that said, it's **** all to do with me lol

As Edd pointed out there is a huge difference between a favour and a service. If I ask a fellow member on here to do me a solid then I also accept the unwritten rules which follow such an arrangement.

I would never expect a refund if said item was lost and I would also expect that it would take second place to any real life events such as work and family. But that's me and you said Iain gave up a refund without you having to ask which I think shows his character. Sorta sucks when you offer to do someone a favour, make a genuine mistake and it ends up costing you.

I've had plenty of members on here help me with OS purchases and I wouldn't blame them one bit if in the future any of them decide it's not worth it if it could end up costing them to do so.

Quick question , what would you have done if the item was lost or damaged in transit? Would you have expected Iain to foot the bill for that?

Iain I'd seriously consider typing up some sort of disclaimer in the future bud, I know it sounds a bit much but with the regularity in which you do this for people it may not be such a bad idea.

Just a point of note - I didn't name BB - he outed himself

I was really annoyed and vented on here which last time I looked was acceptable - I was annoyed at his reaction and just wanted to point out to people that if I do you a favour and then make a mistake (which I then pay for) then don't give me a load of emotional blackmail

Simple as that

Lost or damaged in transit, either on route from original seller or the middle person to the buyer is totally the original buyers problem to deal with, of course it is. Lost at the middle persons house is a different matter and totally warranted a refund.

Dannywhiteley said:

Now to put a fresh perspective on it, I could easily see how an air of suspicion might waft across this situation if it was a bargain, high value item that got lost (let's say a $50 21 back fett). If it wasn't for Iains top rep the buyer could feel it hadn't actually got lost but been conveniently 'mislaid'. Assuming its a common $50 mailer that could easily be replaced (not a $50 Fett mailer for example), it clears that concern up immediately (ps I'm not in any way insinuating anything, just saying how it could have gone down).l

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Another point of note - if this is in anyway something that anybody could potentially feel then please never ask anyone, and me especially, to forward an item on. If you can even think for 1 second that the person doing it will screw you over then you should not ask for their help

Also by posting on here you sort of forced BB's hand to respond. Otherwise it would be a one sided argument and would in your mind totally vindicate your position without giving him fair right for reply or offering both sides of the story.

itfciain said:

Dannywhiteley said:

Now to put a fresh perspective on it, I could easily see how an air of suspicion might waft across this situation if it was a bargain, high value item that got lost (let's say a $50 21 back fett). If it wasn't for Iains top rep the buyer could feel it hadn't actually got lost but been conveniently 'mislaid'. Assuming its a common $50 mailer that could easily be replaced (not a $50 Fett mailer for example), it clears that concern up immediately (ps I'm not in any way insinuating anything, just saying how it could have gone down).l

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Another point of note - if this is in anyway something that anybody could potentially feel then please never ask anyone, and me especially, to forward an item on. If you can even think for 1 second that the person doing it will screw you over then you should not ask for their help

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I agree. But without knowing BB's mind I dont know if that would even cross it. Just a suggestion as to how it could have affected the situation, especially if the 'value' (not cost) was high. That was discussed earlier on as something that shouldn't affect the situation, whereas I think it could if the original buyer and person doing the favour were not close.

As I said, not insinuating anything just offerin a perspective. Back dooring has been widely known in this hobby over the years unfortunately, from the very top to the bottom and many formerly very strong friendships lost as a result.

I think you're making rules up as you go there Danny, from what I've seen in the past it's the seller who is responsible for ensuring safe delivery of goods to the buyer.

Dannywhiteley said:

Also by posting on here you sort of forced BB's hand to respond. Otherwise it would be a one sided argument and would in your mind totally vindicate your position without giving him fair right for reply or offering both sides of the story.

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I am / was not forcing anyone's hand at all.

I have about 20 odd packages arrive each week for me to forward on to various people - if they want to get arsey with me if something happens then I would like them to know that I would rather not do it for them

Yes, this thread was a rant but in no way did it force anyone to do anything

BlueDog said:

I think you're making rules up as you go there Danny, from what I've seen in the past it's the seller who is responsible for ensuring safe delivery of goods to the buyer.

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Ffs. It wasn't lost in transit. It was lost at his house.

Oh dear, never mind.

So it's the original ebay (I assume it was an eBay purchase) sellers fault Iain lost it at his house? How the **** does that work?

Of course it's not the original Ebay sellers fault if it was lost at Iain's place, my original question was would Iain be expected to be financially responsible if it had been damaged or lost in transit from him to BB?

If I add the word **** in will it make my statement have more impact?

It helps.

I already said that damage in transit isn't iains (or whoever is doing the favour) fault. Lost at his house is though unfortunately.

Guys this is unfortunate the way this whole thing has ended up. I don't think we will solve the problem and I feel for both guys.
I have bought alot for lain and I don't know him personally but I would totally trust him with anything I would order.
Why don't you all put it to bed things can get said in the heat of the moment. Nothing productive is coming from this and I really hope this doesn't put lain off helping some of us again.
If he decided to help only guys he personally knows from now on I would totally understand why.
Remember he does these things as a favour for us.
Maybe this thread is a good thing because it highlights the risks we take when we ask someone else to help us. You increse the risk when it starts passing through more hands.

Dannywhiteley said:

It helps.

I already said that damage in transit isn't iains (or whoever is doing the favour) fault. Lost at his house is though unfortunately.

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:shock:

A mate of mine came around to watch the footy and spilt a glass of wine on my carpet the other night. Naturally I charged him for the wine and the cleaning costs.