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Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Information on variations, weapons, cleaning and repair etc
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Tue Jan 12, 2016 3:32 pm

Other Multi Packs

Just a few more packs here, a couple that were included in sets & 2 that were available from stores as is

ESB Yellow 6 Pack, one of 2 ESB 6 packs available from stores here in the UK,I am not sure if these were also offered for sale across the pond, this one came with all figures in ESB-a baggies & where the green snake yoda baggie can be found - PHOTO COURTESY OF MARK YEO

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ESB Red 6 Pack, infinitely rarer than its yellow counterpart above, all baggies in this pack were ESB-c type - PHOTO COURTESY OF MARK YEO

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Photo of my pack with the baggies -

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Cloud city play set Box & Rebel Command Center Packs, will get a better photo of each soon as I get a chance -

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Last edited by Frunkstar on Sat Feb 04, 2017 5:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:44 am

FAKES – what to look out for & how best to avoid getting stung on your baggie collecting journey.

I would like to dedicate this section to Bill Rodgers, otherwise unaffectionately known as Billy Boy scum bucket filth of the earth Rodgers.

Be aware this fakes section is a WORK IN PROGRESS!! many photos & further details & descriptions will be forthcoming, I appreciated your patience whilst this is in progress

In this section I aim to try & tackle a few of the hurdles in the baggie collecting field, there are (as with anything of value) many fakes circulating in the market, some very easy to spot, some not so.

The most commonly faked baggie in existence has to be the ROTJ-c baggie which is basically the same as a ESB-c but with green/grey text rather than bright blue, the reason for this being the most faked bag bar none is IMO purely due to the fact that not hundreds but thousands of removeable limbed 3PO's have been unearthed over the years, many 200 figure shipping cases turned up & it is IMO these baggies that are more often than not used to “rebag” figures I.E opening the tape seal & inserting a more expensive & desirable figure in its place, 99 times out 100 these are easy to spot due to several factors, the first being – did this figure ever come in that baggies type??, not many figures have been found in the ROTJ-c baggie so be cautious when looking to buy a figure coming in this baggie type!, I will go into tape seals/reseals further down the post & cover what you will need to look for to easily spot a fake no matter how well it has been done.

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Here is an example of a genuine ROTJ-c baggie R.L 3p0 & above a fake example of a DIY made Hollow tubes tusken raider in resealed one below , note the baggie & figure can now both be classed as fakes -

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Close up of faked hollow tubes -

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2nd most commonly faked baggie award has to go to the Kenner Super Powers range of figures which were also produced by kenner for vintage figures, but are clearly not the same as their star wars equivalents, the most obvious of which is they are much much wider than the ESB-a baggies (version 2 / later issue) they aim to imitate, ESB-a baggies are always heat sealed, so if you see this style baggie with a tape seal it is undoubtedly a fake, these crop up with great frequency, some are on ebay now as I type this out, they are used the same as the ROTJ-c I spoke of as are available in great numbers & are not expensive, the only baggie style they IMO actually come close to is the POTF A & B baggie which came with last 17 figures in the later (2nd) issue version of the Jabba's Dungeon playset, but those are a crisp baggies & these fake super powers ones are of a soft & quite thick material.

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A super powers baggie with the correct figure in above & below a faked blue snag baggie in the same super powers baggie, FYI Blue Snag was only ever issued in a single baggie type, that being the SW-c -

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& another prime example of a faked super powers baggie here, this time heat sealed rather than tape sealed

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& IMO another prime example, but I am sure the owners of these would argue the point, this one is shown on the SWCA as a genuine baggie, but IMO on consideration of all the facts at hand I would say it is a fake & not the genuine article.

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& finally a pic with a selection of super powers range figure shown alongside their opened baggies

Next would have to be the ESB-h no text large baggies, not so often seen faked, but they are out there, it does not help that the genuine ESB-h baggies have multiple incarnations (see linked thread) - viewtopic.php?f=16&t=13371 & the fact there can be quite some variation in the seals on these as IMO these were haistly made as a substitute stand in baggie for shortfalls on order (speculation), though as with other fakes, if you follow a few ground rules a fake should be something easy enough to spot to the trained eye, I have even seen sandwich bags heat sealed up being peddled as ESB-h baggies, so caution is again always advised when buying ESB-h style baggies.

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The above is what is considered to be a faked ESB-h, but with so many showing up they could also easily be kenner dead/overstock baggies, either done directly by Kenner or at a later date by whomever bought up the remaining dead stock, either way it's not a correct ESB-h baggie, & below a number of ESB-h baggies in their various incarnations with the regular ESB-h to start with -

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Standard ESB-h

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500 figure Kenner overstock baggie, also often seen by many as an ESB-h

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Clipper No text version of the mailer baggie, not a real ESB-h but often mistaken as such

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ESB-h (Extra Wide) speculated to have been available at the Kenner plant for employees on dollar tables

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Kenner alternative 500 figure case overstock baggie, also IMO wrongly regarded as an ESB-h baggie NOTE the top & bottom twin heat seals

Next contender is the ESB-c baggie, again as it's one that is very commonly available, purely due to the fact it's the most commonly used Kenner baggie in the toy line with a great many figures coming in the baggie type, I have seen them with figure swaps many a time, with re taped or heat sealed in an attempt to pass them off as the next issue ESB-d baggie which is identical to the ESB-c, only difference obviously is that one came taped the other heat sealed.

I don't actually have any faked ESB-c baggies or photos on file sadly, but do have the next best thing, this is a Palitoy-a baggie ( the palitoy equivalent of the ESB-c), which is clearly a fake, this one traces directly back to Bill Rodgers (Mr King of faked baggies) & is obviously a fake/rebagged figure, as on close inspection you can clearly see some residual blue tack on the weapon inside the baggie.

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Below a genuine ESB-c -

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FAKE SEALS & WHAT TO LOOK FOR -

On close inspection in good natural lighting (daylight) most fakes can be spotted with a little bit of deductive reasoning & a sharp eye for detail, ask yourself the following questions if you think you have a baggie that could be a possible fake -

HEAT SEALED BAGGIES FIRST -

1. Does the heat seal look right?
2. Is the heat seal messy & disjointed
3. is the bag the same length as other confirmed legitimate examples of this baggie style/type?
4. Do both the heat seals conform to other legit examples of this baggie type – 95% of the time they should do, it is very seldom I have seen an exception to the rule
5. is the font the correct size/colour & print style as a know legit example?
6. Also look at the side seals of the baggie, does it look like it may have been reduced in width & resealed (super powers baggies)

TAPE SEALED BAGGIES -

1. is the tape clean clear? Obviously some yellow, but it is too clear if there is such a thing?
2. The tape ends – do they conform to know ones, ie the cut pattern of how the tape was broken – there are many many variations so always look
3. tape width – may seem obvious, but have you checked the tape width is correct?
4. Tape slip – this is where the tape seal has actually moved over time due to environmental (heat & cold) & storage issues & the passing of time, though tape slip is a known factor, is there too much tape slip or is the tape slip going in a different direction to the actual seal??
5. particulates under the tape – if there is anything in between the tape on either top or bottom portion of the seal (fluff/hair/dirt/dust etc) then it's almost a given fact the baggie has at some point been opened & resealed, it is normal to often find all sorts of residue round the edges of tape as well as in the gap between top (main bit of bag) & bottom (folded over portion) of the baggie if there is a gap as there is sometime & not other times.
6. Creases & folds in the baggie where the seal is or directly under it
7. creases & pick marks in the baggie at the edges of the seal or close to it – has it got any? If so this is a sure sign someone has been carefully trying to lift a previous seal

Heat seal VS tape seal - the baggie you are looking to buy - did it ever come with the seal type is is being offered up for sale with?? if not walk away.

Is the weapon & or accessory genuine? & of the correct style colour for the period in which the baggie type was produced?

Contrary to what the SWCA baggie guide states, most heat sealed baggies do NOT have the same kind of heat seal at the top & the bottom of the baggies, just check one's you have & know are genuine & you will see what I mean - (I have lots of respect for that guide just do not think this point they bring into question is correct)

Is the coo of the figure correct for the baggie?? I.E a Made in hong Kong figure in a China baggie, if this is the case 99% of the time it's a sure sign it's a fake, but not always, there have been some exceptions to this rule, I have seen blank bar (china or for some Ewoks Lily Ledy) figures in genuine palitoy issue baggies which have Hong Kong on them, but it is not a common thing & very few genuine examples like this have surfaced.
Last edited by Frunkstar on Sat Feb 04, 2017 5:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Sat Feb 04, 2017 5:15 pm

OTHER FAKE BAGGIES SEEN TO DATE - - again a work in progress

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Dodgy re bagged Kenner survival kit as sold by Brian's Toys - obvious fake

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ROTJ-h Fett, never known in this baggie type

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Clear crisp thin baggie ree Yee's with close up of the fake perforated heat seal

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Fake fett baggie, just showed up on ebay this week (1/16)

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Unknown & possible fake Zuckuss baggie

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Unknown & possible fake At At Driver baggie, note the weapon is sealed in its own section below the figure

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Red text side tape sealed baggies (Jeff Glanville)

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One I am really on the fence about, I have seen numerous examples of this baggie, so I have sneaking suspicion they are overstock, but could also just as easily be fakes

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Very poor attempted fake Made in china baggie, assumed the baggies are from some other toy line, though no idea which.

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Again a baggie presumed used from some other toy line, this time made in taiwan baggie

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Couple of poor quality fakes, note the heat seals

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Billy Boy special faked woolies 8 pack with missing offer sticker

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Fett mailer with incorrect fake baggie & box does not look right

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Dengar mailer with fake baggies

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Palitoy-a Tri Logo fett with Blue not blue/black blaster, 2nd example to turn up, although this one is a dark brown belt with unpainted knee, same as the one in my woolies 8 pack. UNDER INVESTIGATION - MADE IN READING BAGGIES?

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Palitoy-a Tri Logo fett with what is considered to be correct black blaster, but thats correct on carded, but very nice to see one turn up with a black blaster, 3rd example to turn up, although this one is a dark brown belt with painted knee & mismatched legs, note the dark brown belt, but light brown on the sides, a real oddity, someone was on the happy juice when knocking this one up PHOTO COURTESY OF kevin Bletsoe UNDER INVESTIGATION - MADE IN READING BAGGIES?

FYI I also know of a 4th example, can't confirm what variation or gun sadly - UPDATE 10/9/15 4th example conformation below & another minor variation

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Palitoy-a Tri Logo fett with what is considered to be correct black blaster, but this one has a painted dart & painted knee, dark belt. PHOTO COURTESY OF - Sheldon Wagstaffe UNDER INVESTIGATION - MADE IN READING BAGGIES?

All the above tri log fetts were sold by Jeff Glanville & most if not all have since been confirmed fakes by both AFA & CAS

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Droopy McCool, tri logo Black Made in Hong Kong Text baggie


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Max Rebo - tri logo Black Made in Hong Kong Text

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Sy Snootles tri Logo Made in Hong Kong

All 3 of the above Rebo Bang baggies came from Jeff Glanville & no examples can be confirmed elsewhere & looking at the font closely they are obviously fake, they failed the "tape test"

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Probot version 2 - Not sure on these myself, but many have cropped up, no allocated baggie type for this, but same font arrangement as a Kenner

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Probot version 3 UNCONFIRMED a baggies I have just been made aware of, I have never seen another like it so sadly can not confirm its authenticity but, the backstory 'quote" - picked it up at a market stall in the barras market in Glasgow . Which was in a box of star wars parts lone ranger stuff and a few other old toys games etc. The seller said it was from the stuff she bought for her son and came out of one of the box sets, interesting & was bought at a fair (very very low) price, so why would the seller lie?, be great to find out further info on this baggie. PHOTO COURTESY OF - Kevin Bletsoe loads of these I have seen for sale came from Jeff Glanville & looking at the seals I am pretty confident in saying they are fakes Note the tell tale "tram line" heat seal

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Dianoga (trash compactor monster) this one came in a very thick baggie similar to the ESB-h baggies but its a larger baggie with much thicker material, only available in the US Kenner issued death star play set, I have since confirmed that the dianoga came in a baggie along with the foam bits with the US Kenner issued Death star play set & NOT in a baggie like this, so I am assuming this is an overstock figure that was either bagged at the factory for onward sale as overstock or done at a later date for onward sale by whomever bought up the overstock, as the guy I bought this off has several of these he purchased in bulk many years ago from the states, as such it is unconfirmed & must untill further provenance is found be classed as a possible FAKE - most examples if not all have come from Jeff Glanville so I am assuming they are indeed fake
Last edited by Frunkstar on Sat Feb 09, 2019 10:10 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Sat Feb 04, 2017 6:29 pm

Pre-production / Sample Related Baggie's & Items

PENDING CONSTRUCTION

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QC Sign off Sample Barada COURTESY OF Derek Ho

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Signed QC sample Made in Macau baggie (Euro-a)

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Signed QC sample - Euro-i baggie - COURTESY OF BROC WALKER

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QC Sign off ESB 4 pack COURTESY OF BROC WALKER

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J slots Rocket Firing Fett - This awesome piece turned up last year & amazed everyone, it's J slots Rocket Firing Fett whith no text baggie & mailer box (internal sample) Photo Courtesy of Darrell Johnson & Brendi Burton

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Unpainted General Veers in ESB-d baggie (internal sample) courtesy of Somma Christian

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1st shot Luke Hoth in ESB-d - image courtesy of Gary Borbidge
Last edited by Frunkstar on Sun Dec 02, 2018 5:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Wed May 16, 2018 7:21 pm

Cinema Find

Here is what the guy wrote about what he knows about his great find -

"It was 39 years ago so it’s hard to get the details right without finding it in writing somewhere. However I’m sure the film opened at the Westgate in May 1977, although I can’t say for certain that it was May 25.

Some theaters apparently opened a couple of days later. It was an exclusive run in the Portland, OR market, no other theaters in that market could play it as long as we were running it. I think that may be why we kept it running so long, to exclude other theaters from playing it. The owner, Tom Moyer had a brother Larry who also owned a theater chain in Portland, and they were bitter, bitter competitors.

When I entered the scene I believe in September 1977, it was still very busy, selling out both shows on Friday and Saturday nights, and Sunday matinees. We also had two other auditoriums that were busy with other films.

I remember finding the box under the counter in the box office, and asked why we had these toys. The cashier said they were given away to ticket buyers in the opening days of the film. I don’t know, but it’s possible they ran newspaper ads with a coupon, and something like the first 50 customers each show got a toy.

That kind of promotion was not unusual in those days, but I have no proof. Maybe with a little more research.

Today is the first time I’ve ever emptied the box to see what was really in there, and must say I was a bit disappointed. Instead of being a bunch of sets of four, here is the inventory: 19 of R2-D2, all wrapped 15 of Luke, one unwrapped 6 of Chewbacca, one unwrapped 2 of Leia, both wrapped I also noticed that Luke’s lightsaber is extendable via a little mechanism in the back of his arm.

I am wondering if the figures in the Early Bird sets have this feature as well. The address on the box shows it didn’t come directly from Kenner, but from The Maple Plains Company, Inc., One Industrial Drive, Maple Plains, MN 55359. The box also has written in felt tip pen ‘150 pcs Luke’.

It’s possible each figure came in bulk in it’s own box, and the theater just lumped them all into one at the end of the promotion.

Just from my knowledge of the movie theater business in those days, I think it unlikely that Tom Moyer Luxury Theaters would buy toys for a promotion. It’s much more likely they came through the distributor, which was 20th Century Fox (or a company distributing for them). I know that when the film opened there was not any idea it would be so huge, and that’s why Kenner wasn’t geared up to make more toys quickly.
"

Below are the images of what was found, it is worth nothing this is the only known SW era shipper for baggies, though it does not state "bagged" IE a specific baggies shipping case like later examples as you can see, but these are what the figures were sent in for the promotion.

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Last edited by Frunkstar on Sun Mar 03, 2019 5:58 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Comprehensive Guide to Baggies , please do not post here

Postby Frunkstar » Wed May 16, 2018 7:23 pm

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