Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Discuss vintage Kenner and Palitoy Star Wars toys from the 1977-1985 era.
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by Ian_C » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:00 am

tiefighterboy wrote:one things for sure. He has sold fakes. Was aware long ago he had sold some and learned nothing from it as he still continued to sell them even if it was due to lack of knowledge.
This is the one thing that still really concerns me.

Obviously no one can prove who made them. There is a concern that if most (if not all) are traceable back to him as a seller and no one else, it raises red flags - but still, no proof is there. In this regard, the original accusations of him manufacturing them wasn't well supported. Having said that, I'm not even going to focus on who made them.

However, I can't wrap my head around how someone could be told about fakes they have been selling for several years, yet still continue to sell them. He should have more than enough experience to be able to tell some of those for sure.

I'm not saying this to cause trouble or instigate drama. I'm legitimately confused on how he can still sell so many fakes "unknowingly" after all this time.

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by Joseph_Y » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:04 am

finestcomics wrote:
Hothrebel wrote:
Lee Bullock wrote: let not turn this into a witch hunt.

Peace out

Lee

Too late !!
Agreed. This pattern of witch hunts going on has been allowed to get completely out of hand because of politics, rivalries, and deluded ego's that think they are beyond reproach. The last one saw the mud-slingers cinch their saddles without as much as an apology to the wronged party, and I hope for the sake of those involved here they have proof to back the accusations, because this is one situation which the community shouldn't allow to slip by without people answering to this.
This situation is a bit different than some of the other more recent witch hunts, as it so far seems that no one is pushing a personal vendetta against Jeff, no one's manufacturing fake evidence against him, accusing him of being someone he isn't, or just talking rude shit just to piss him off and make him blow his top to make themselves feel good. This has been just very straight forward outing some, now that we're looking for it, very sketchy looking baggies that he's the main source of. I don't know Jeff in any way, but he seems to be being upfront in his replies. I still don't understand why baggie's he'd been told weren't right, ended up back for sale, that's really the only sticking point that has me wondering WTF about him, other than that w/o proof that he was making them, lets see if he follows thru with the refund process and provides pics of all the baggies that he's had to help sort out what people have, while I'd guess that it was a mix of real and fake ones to help hide the fakes better, something other scammers, like Pablo Artesi, Scott Mc, etc have done in the past, it would still be a good catalogue to help sort things out, if he's willing to provide that info.

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by Bootyhunter » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:12 am

SOJ wrote:
Bootyhunter wrote:
Bonsai_Tree_Ent wrote:Hang on, doesn't this forum have a whole sub section called SELLERS TO AVOID with dozens of instances where an unhappy forum member has outed a seller for being dodgy?

Playing devils advocate here... but how many of those sellers were forewarned?
Exactly what I was thinking, also plenty of dodgy sellers are fingered on the Ebay thread. It seems to me that some of you guys are going to stand by Jeff regardless
Having your real name, alongside a photo posted of you, with links to multiple vintage FB groups leading thousands to view the thread is a bit different IMO. Look at Edd's graph on the "today on facebook" thread to see how traffic through this site accelerated when those links went up.

Selling a repro saber and getting called out as a SELLER TO AVOID is a bit different to what this guys been accused of.

What evidence is there is manufactured baggies? Why are you so sure he did that? Where is the evidence?
I do not use facebook so I wasn't aware the guys photo had been used, I did not say I was sure he did it either

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by jedisearcher » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:28 am

aussiejames wrote:
jedisearcher wrote:Being objective, the piece of evidence that would help Jeff would be some proof he spent a ton of money with jawa93 or whatever his username was, as it establishes a trail back to a possible faker. Without it you take your pick with whether you believe he did/didn't fake them himself. If my name was being dragged through the mud I'd be in the phone 24/7 to PayPal or my Bank immediately to firmly establish that fact. Those records will be there, no doubt about it.

But even then, isn't it a bit of a stretch to think someone (jawa93 potentially as that's the name out there), produced hundreds of these things, sold them all in one batch and never went and produced more? If you were so minded to have faked a load of them, sold them for serious money (to Jeff) then why on earth would you not do it again, and again?? People like that don't stop til they're caught. It doesn't stack up.

I gave a link to Jawa39 ( Gratson) I assume it's the same guy??
Yes James, but even if that name is wrong my point about evidence to substantiate the fact he's bought from someone as oppposed to manufacturing them himself is the key for me at least.
WTB thread - most Palitoy 30b's and 3 debut 45a's: http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopi ... =8&t=17224

Memories from a 1980s Toy Shop: http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopi ... =1&t=24289

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by SOJ » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:29 am

Bootyhunter wrote:
SOJ wrote:
Bootyhunter wrote:
Exactly what I was thinking, also plenty of dodgy sellers are fingered on the Ebay thread. It seems to me that some of you guys are going to stand by Jeff regardless
Having your real name, alongside a photo posted of you, with links to multiple vintage FB groups leading thousands to view the thread is a bit different IMO. Look at Edd's graph on the "today on facebook" thread to see how traffic through this site accelerated when those links went up.

Selling a repro saber and getting called out as a SELLER TO AVOID is a bit different to what this guys been accused of.

What evidence is there is manufactured baggies? Why are you so sure he did that? Where is the evidence?
I do not use facebook so I wasn't aware the guys photo had been used, I did not say I was sure he did it either
But you did say some guys are going to stand by Jeff regardless, if your not sure yourself then surely you can I understand their position?

Like I've said previously I've met the guy once, I didn't buy any baggies from him, personally I've got very little interest in baggies. I just think the way this guy has been hung out to dry for manufacturing baggies with no hard and fast evidence stinks. If Frank or one of the others come on and prove this what he was doing I will be the first to do a 180 and apologise for doubting them.
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by jedisearcher » Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:40 am

Richard_H wrote:He claims to be a technophobe.
So he uses the Internet, eBay and PayPal on a daily basis, maybe rebelscum in the past, but he's too technophobe to log onto a forum? Hard to believe, but not as hard to believe as the fact that he's forgotten who he bought thousands of £ worth of stuff from.
WTB thread - most Palitoy 30b's and 3 debut 45a's: http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopi ... =8&t=17224

Memories from a 1980s Toy Shop: http://www.starwarsforum.co.uk/viewtopi ... =1&t=24289

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:30 am

First and foremost the whole point of this thread was to warn the community about fake baggies that are in circulation, granted I think it's clear things could of been handled differently in regards to the way this came out but it is what it is now. I think frank mentioned that he told Jeff some baggies were not correct and he sold them regardless so what would be the point in him contacting Jeff to say you have been selling shit loads of baggies for years that I believe to be fake, was Jeff going to turn around and say I best contact everyone I sold them to and offer a refund.....was he heck....would you?

This is in no uncertain terms any kind of a witch hunt or victimisation towards Jeff, the fact is jeff has been selling these fake baggies for at least two years and we feel the volume of baggies and the amount of different type(s) of fake baggies leading directly back to him warranted him being named.

It's a well known fact that Jeff is very forthcoming when it comes to refunds and would imagine it's something he has become very accustom to over the years, it's common knowledge amongst collectors that he always refunds in a quiet manner and nothing else is said about it and is swept under the carpet so to speak, I think in most cases people are just happy to have got there money back, I'm surprised and a bit disappointed that more collectors have not come out and said the same, there is no denying jeff is a great source for baggies with top contacts, he also sells lots of high end legit items and imagine a lot of collectors don't want to burn bridges with him.

I don't think any one has come out and said Jeff is out and out faking these baggies himself and even if he was I doubt that could be proven so let's just leave that alone. Jeff said all his baggies are from his collection and he is just selling of his 1000+ baggie collection, anyone who deals with Jeff knows he always has big hauls coming in, so why is he acting like he's just some guy selling of his collection, if you have ever dealt with Jeff you will know he means business when it comes money and vintage sw so I don't get the whole selling of my collection routine????

if I'm being honest I feel some of the posts on here regarding frank are really unfair and immature, some post make frank look like a crank (that rhymes lol) and some kind of conspiracy nut job which he is far from. Knowing the kind of person frank is I doubt he will do a podcast, he's a bit of a caveman and doubt that would be his bag, I wouldn't blame him either as I thought the whole podcast (today's) thing was really very tacky tbh

If Jeff has been collecting and buying and selling as long as he has then some of these fakes should of been spotted a mile away because quite frankly some are just dog shit!!! he's either very stupid (he's far from), careless or just doesn't care and sold them regardless, either way he should be held accountable for his actions.

I think I speak for everyone on the group here when I say the intention was never a malice one, it was not a witch hunt it was a fact finding mission to put a stop to the fake baggies that were being sold by jeff and polluting the collecting world, if we have achieved that then that's mission accomplished in my eyes.

I think frank will be putting some kind of information/guide online in regards to spotting the fakes soon and it's worth noting that Jeff sells lots of legit stuff so no point in panicking as I'm sure many are fine

I'm going to post some pics of the baggies Jeff has sold on eBay and to other collectors below, some are recent and some are not and were sold two or more years ago.
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Sold to another collector
Sold to another collector
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Sold to another collector
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One he sold to a collector
One he sold to a collector
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Recent fett from ebay
Recent fett from ebay
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Recent fett from eBay
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:33 am

More
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Here's a Lando and Han from his recent eBay sales
Here's a Lando and Han from his recent eBay sales
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:36 am

Some more sold to another collector
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:37 am

Couple more
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:38 am

This ones really bad
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:40 am

Here's another one, this one was returned because the figure was apperntly a later issued figure that was not correct in this early baggie
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Last edited by momike on Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:41 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:45 am

Iffy sw b baggies that ukg knocked back and were traced back to Jeff
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:48 am

A really iffy one he had listed on eBay recently
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Re: Long Time suspected FAKE baggies scam / seller

Post by momike » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:51 am

Iffy sw d
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